[Tccc] Requesting open feedback to my work (Re: Promoting open on-line research)
Pars Mutaf
pars.mutaf
Thu Nov 3 08:59:49 EDT 2011
On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 2:53 PM, Luigi Iannone <luigi at net.t-labs.tu-berlin.de
> wrote:
> Hi Pars,
>
> I am not sure I understand your last email.
>
> In particular I fail to see any answer to my clarification questions.
>
We are here the one who asks for help: There is a problem. What can we do?
Some people here clearly agree that there is problem.
If you don't see the problem, I don't know you can do for us.
>
> thanks
>
> Luigi
>
> On Nov 3, 2011, at 12:28 , Pars Mutaf wrote:
>
> Hi Luigi,
>
> Please all stop calling it "your" approach it is not mine.... Check arxiv,
> IETF, liquidpub, etc.
>
> Please see below:
>
> On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 12:28 PM, Luigi Iannone <
> luigi at net.t-labs.tu-berlin.de> wrote:
>
>>
>> On Nov 3, 2011, at 10:46 , Pars Mutaf wrote:
>>
>> [snip]
>> >> I think you should clearly expose the rules of your system, I really
>> >> do not understand how does it work.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Hi Emmanuel,
>> >
>> > Normally you should come with answer not questions (it is not only my
>> > idea).
>> > I mean: Question the current system not the new one to come.
>> >
>>
>> Pars,
>>
>> Why should we trust your system without questioning it?
>> If that is what you want why you are opening the discussion on this
>> mailing list?
>>
>>
>
> Why do you defend the current system and not think of a new one? See the
> petition for
> some serious problems that we have in the current one:
>
>
> http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/replacing-scientific-conferences-with-a-cheap-and-effic.html
>
>
>
>> Let me take advantage of this mail to raise another point (please correct
>> me if I misunderstood your model).
>>
>> You stated several times that conferences take too long to provide
>> feedback.
>>
>> How much time do you think will take in your open system for a paper to
>> have sufficient review feedback so that it can become a meaningful
>> publication?
>>
>>
> How can you contribute to this problem?
>
>
>
>> I mean, the fact that you post online a paper does not make the paper
>> automatically correct, interesting, or actually providing a real
>> contribution.
>
>
>
> The fact that it is published in a conference makes it interesting or
> useful?
>
>
>
>> So I wouldn't consider it a real publication that can be referenced until
>> either I review it myself (but I cannot review all the papers I cite in my
>> publications) or I wait that someone else does the review.
>>
>> And what are the incentives to review in your model? Why should I
>> actually spend time on your paper?
>>
>>
> How can we solve this problem? What model do you propose?
>
>
>
>> In conferences and journals there an organizational infrastructure that
>> guarantees me that as I do review for others people articles other people
>> will review my paper. In your open system it may happens that I spend time
>> reviewing papers and nobody will ever have a look at my papers.
>>
>>
> You think that there is no solution? Check for example the IETF model, it
> has been working for decades.
>
> Why defend the current system I don't get your point. Please explain.
>
> Pars
>
>
>
>
>
>> ciao
>>
>> Luigi
>>
>>
>>
>> >
>> http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/replacing-scientific-conferences-with-a-cheap-and-effic.html
>> > Pars
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >>
>> >> Emmanuel
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> Pars
>> >>>
>> >>> On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 10:08 AM, Usman Ashraf <
>> >> m_usman_ashraf at hotmail.com>wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Dear All,
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Is there a point that I'm missing? why don't we just submit our work
>> to
>> >> a
>> >>>> reputed journal for feedback?
>> >>>> Most reputed journals don't charge anything, don't cost as much as
>> >>>> conferences and provide us with a decent feedback.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> regards
>> >>>> Usman.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> Date: Thu, 3 Nov 2011 09:43:11 +0200
>> >>>>> From: pars.mutaf at gmail.com
>> >>>>> To: touch at isi.edu
>> >>>>> CC: tccc at lists.cs.columbia.edu
>> >>>>> Subject: [Tccc] Requesting open feedback to my work (Re: Promoting
>> >> open
>> >>>> on-line research)
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Hi all,
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Could you please send feedback for the following work. I don't want
>> to
>> >>>>> submit it to conferences just for feedback. I would therefore need
>> >> your
>> >>>>> opinion:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> http://arxiv.org/abs/1103.5115
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Or, please point me to me to a list working on this kind of topic.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Pars
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> PS: Based on the below idea, this is a test for open research.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 5:20 PM, Joe Touch <touch at isi.edu> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> On 11/1/2011 11:37 PM, Pars Mutaf wrote:
>> >>>>>> ...
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Conferences may have the benefits that are listed above. The
>> >> problem is
>> >>>>>>> being tied to conferences just for receiving feedback.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> It's useful to appreciate that it has always been possible to write
>> >>>> drafts
>> >>>>>> and tech reports and post them - either via direct email, or to
>> >> lists*
>> >>>> for
>> >>>>>> discussion or feedback.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> *This list in particular is intended for exactly this kind of
>> >>>> discussion;
>> >>>>>> we are often overrun with CFPs, but they is NOT the primary
>> >> motivation
>> >>>> for
>> >>>>>> this list.*
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Joe (TCCC Chair)
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> *it's more useful to post only the abstract, not the full text or
>> >> PDF
>> >>>> FWIW.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> *there are many IEEE Comsoc TCs; it's always useful to post your
>> >> ideas
>> >>>> to
>> >>>>>> the TC most specific to your work.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>> IEEE Communications Society Tech. Committee on Computer
>> Communications
>> >>>>> (TCCC) - for discussions on computer networking and communication.
>> >>>>> Tccc at lists.cs.columbia.edu
>> >>>>> https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/cucslists/listinfo/tccc
>> >>>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> IEEE Communications Society Tech. Committee on Computer Communications
>> >>> (TCCC) - for discussions on computer networking and communication.
>> >>> Tccc at lists.cs.columbia.edu
>> >>> https://lists.cs.columbia.edu/cucslists/listinfo/tccc
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
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